What My Market Research Parents Missed: Habits We Need to Break

Alrighty, we are at the top of the hour and this is our final installment for November's conference series. So, thank you for joining us. If you're just coming on, thank you for sticking with us. If you've been with us today, my name is Julie Paddock. I am a director of client solutions at Accelerant Research and I am very happy today to introduce our final speaker. But before I do that, I have to cover some ground rules. So if we have any tech glitches, please just be patient with us. We are at the mercy of this technology. Uh but so far so good. So keep your fingers crossed. Um secondly, we want to make sure if you're engaging, please be respectful. Uh but we do want you to engage and please put questions into the chat. Uh we're also live on YouTube and you can put questions in there if you would like to use that format instead. Um but without further ado, I'm really excited to talk uh to have our final speaker talk to you today. Um the title of his um discussion is what my market research parents missed and the habits we need to break. I'm welcoming Solomon Bennett. He is the senior director of guest insights at Veil Resorts. And I am going to let you take it away. All right, Julie. Thank you. Thank you to Well, one you Julie also thank uh Bill who invited me. Um and thank you to all the attendees uh for today. Um I am the last speaker. So hopefully um I will keep everyone engaged and uh interested in the topic. I'm going to try to uh gracefully share my screen. Um and we'll we'll see how that goes. Um and uh you know take it take it from there. Uh let's and actually while Solomon is pulling up his slides, I did want to mention one thing and I'm going to do it now instead of the end. And that is that all of the presentations that you've seen today are going to be available for download on our conference bite or through YouTube. So, if you want to revisit any of the great speakers we had today, please go there. They'll be on there for a few days, so you can download them. So, uh, with that, please take it away, Solomon. Okay. And Julie, let me know. Is the presentation showing in full screen? Um, it looks great. Okay, we're good to go then. Okay. All right. Okay. So um today's uh topic that I chose is what my market research parents missed and the habits we must break. Um and first of all before I start this conversation because it's really more of a conversation than me presenting. Um so I welcome thoughts and reactions as we go through this. Um but first let me tell you who I am. So I'm Solomon Bennett. Um, I was born and raised in Chicago. Um, and uh, knew kind of early on in my life that I want to kind of work in the marketing and the marketing research field. Um, I attended the University of Illinois in Champagne, Bana, uh, where my masters was focused on advertising research. So, I went to school for this. It's something I've been doing for the last 20 years. Um, and I've had a lot of different uh roles and learned a lot, experienced a lot through the years. I've kind of thrown up on the screen many of the various places I've worked. Um, started off my career at an ad agency, then went into the media world, still with the focus of research at BET, Eony Jet Magazine. I worked in retail um, at both Walmart um, where I worked both on the consumer side as well as the employee side. Uh, also at Target, uh, Chico's FAS, if you know that company, their clothing retailer, mall retailer, Chico's White House Black Market, Soma, um, and most recently I, um, was at, uh, Vel Resorts. And so, this topic today, uh, I I'm going to tell you a little bit about why I chose this topic, but before we get to that, um, let's talk about what I'm going to talk about. And so, uh, this notion around, you know, what my market parents missed, market research parents missed. Now, my real parents weren't market researchers. They were actually school teachers, but I'm referring to kind of those supervisors, the bosses and mentors that we've had over the years and kind of the things that we learned and maybe some of the things that we've had to unlearn over the years. And so today's topic is going to start with talking about you know what were those habits that I kind of learn old habits that I kind of learned early in my career in early thousands you know they were great at the time but don't necessarily translate till today so why must we break them we'll talk about how those habits are either have been broken or I have evolved them and I have transformed myself and my teams uh through this notion talk talk about why this change was necessary and then leaves kind of some call to action like what do we do with this information like how do we put into into um into use and then lastly you know save some time for us to kind of get your reactions and questions and answers around this. Okay. So let's talk about how I arrived at this topic. Last year I attended a market research conference. I'm not going to say which one but there were a lot of conversations I heard from my peers uh at this conference. um a lot of worries and a lot of concerns which really concerned me um as their fellow professional. One thing I heard from one particular I'll just use some real stories. One lady I was talking to she was a qualitative expert and she was telling me she was really worried about her job because she was finding that AI was taking her job. And what she meant was um she was a qualitative expert. She did discussion guides, you know, she moderated and one of her clients came to her and had already developed the full-on discussion guide and she's like, "Oh my god, this is what I would normally do." Now her clients are coming to her um with their AI written discussion guide and she was feeling a little bit lost in what she had to do. The second person I was talking to kind of in this round, Robin, uh she was really concerned about her insights team losing their seat at the table. There's a lot of talk about analytics and a lot of fluence was coming from the analytics team and she was really concerned about okay as an insights function you know how does she stay relevant um as things were evolving within her company. Another person there that reached out to me, she talked a lot about how she heard a lot of the buzz around CX and UX and EX and she was starting to feel and questioning what was her role in all of this because she kind of saw market research as separate from these um other disciplines and so she was really feeling like am I redundant? Is this overlapping kind of what is you know what is my role for today? And then I think the last thing which you know like many of you when I've been out here looking for work and looking for jobs is a lot of postings will ask for someone who has analytics and insights right they want you to be and so it's almost like you have to be this magic unicorn where you have to be really great and market research or you you know and you know in the job listing they have market research and then they want you to be a data data scientist all rolled up in one. And so you end up finding that they say analytics and insights and sometimes they want a market research person, but a lot of times they want someone with a data science background um and a skill set. And so again, this other um person at the conference, she was explaining to me how she was just feeling very confused in her job search as to again what role she played. And so these conversations, you know, sparked from me some thinking around, you know, how do we get here as an industry, particularly for people who have always considered themselves consumer insights or kind of market research folk and how do we, you know, how do we how do we arrive here? And so this has got me to thinking about let's take a step back and think about what are those old habits. You know what were those things, those habits, those unwritten rules that were passed down to us by our mentors that might have worked maybe 20 years ago, but now they need to evolve, you know, and so this conversation today is what I call a kitchen table discussion is amongst us market research peers is to really explore, you know, what our market research parents, our bosses, our mentors, um the people we looked up to, you know, what did they miss or misunder understand or they worked at the time but might have not led to uh the result that we would want today. You know, and which of those habits do we need to break or refine? Um and I'll share with you some practices that I've adopted to keep my teams and organizations feeling agile and relevant during this time. And so without further ado, let's start to unpack what some of those old habits are and why we must break them. Okay. The first one is what I call methodology snobbery. Um you know I remember early in my career there was a lot of pride in insights functions around how complex methodologies and how rigorous your research practices are and really market research really o I think emphasized and maybe to some degree overemphasized methodology over impact. I remember one of uh my big jobs that I got. I almost missed out on the job because I remember the supervisor that interviewed me, you know, said to me, Solomon, you know, uh the people on our team come from CBG world. You know, they've worked at some of those big major research agencies, and so we're not exactly sure um if you, you know, have the qualifications that we're really looking for for market research talent. Um I eventually through the conversation convinced them that I had what was necessary. But it was a little bit of you know a lot of pride around um where you came from you know what companies you worked for in terms of methods. along with that um there was a lot of along with the snobbery around who they hired a lot of a lot of snobbery I think around or obsession around complexity right and so back then it was like oh we're doing conjooint analyses we're doing max stiff van van westernorp you know those types of things were revered you know and we prov provi we prided ourselves on being able to execute these sophisticated methods um and you know in hindsight I now and thinking, you know, was the client or the business partner truly invested in how we got the insights or were they just more interested in the outcomes, right? And so I think, you know, it was cool for us to nerd out on the methodology and the approach. But in hindsight, you know, was that necessarily um very in a very insular way of looking at it um and should I have been thinking more differently or should I, you know, just our teams be more thinking more outwardly in terms of what the businesses need? The other thing around methodology snobbery um that again struck me interesting was there was a lot of focus and interest around quantitative research. Um and qualitative was almost what I call if quantitative was the Beyonce, qualitative was the Kelly Roland of research, right? It was kind of secondary. Quant was kind of the limelight while quall was seen as um kind of an add-on or a kind of a next level uh uh type of work to be used. Um I remember finally remember one of my bosses jokingly saying, you know, um if you're doing a qualitative project and you have more pages in your discussion guide or your final report than respondents, you know, we have a problem here. And so, you know, there was even joking about you or less taking qualitative uh less seriously. And so, again, as I think about this kind of snobbery approach, we really uh got me to thinking, you know, where we've been now where it's more about not focusing on complex outputs, but really prioritizing methods that are going to get and provide the impact that was really needed. All right. So that was the first one. The second habit was what I call research rigamortis. Um also uh aka what I would call perfection paralysis. And what I mean by that is again I think back in the day there was this expectation that rigor meant perfection and perfection took time. And I think that there was this underlying belief that we were trying to put on our clients and our business partners that every insight had to be thoroughly vetted and bulletproof. Um, you know, in order to be shared and that that's going to take time. If you want quality work and you want it, it's going to take some time. I think the downside of that is that this perfectionism often came at a cost. And that cost could have been you know time to insight was slowed and maybe missing the opportunity to really influence decisions in real time. I think you know there was a lot of again focus and pressure and an attempt and desire to be right for the organization and provide the right answers for the organization. But I think we were overlooking kind of the value of timeliness and the the importance of not a perfect answer but an answer that was necessary for right now. And I think that that hindered us in the sense that you know we could have missed moments to support our partners due to caution and the pursuit of precision. Um I think we were being overly cautious and paralyzed. the need to be perfect was what we were doing and missed the opportunity to meet the need of the speed of the business. And so as we talk about kind of evolving that um you know it leads us to be less paralyzed and also be less perfect and be more transparent in the way that we operate. So that then leads me to the next habit data gatekeeping. Um, you know, I just remember going into organizations in the past and was being told by my peers, you know, we don't share raw data. We don't share data with the partners. Um, they might misinterpret it. They'll they'll draw the wrong conclusions. Um, they don't know what to do with information. And there was this very protective mindset which I think isolated our insights teams. I think we were unintentionally positioning data as something uh as a weapon of mass destruction in the hands of our partners. Um something that was inaccessible and I think that rather than building credibility with our partners, we were fostering almost um some decisiveness with them and uh d and you know this approach fostered maybe mistrust um and made partners maybe feel excluded or undervalued. um you know and I kept thinking to myself if we're all on the same team in the same company the data should be shared right I just never really understood why we were being so protective of information that needed to be shared more broadly so again as we think about how to foster relationships with our partners data is one of those keys that uh really helped to unlock this And then the last habit was this notion of insights being a support function. A support function. Um I just remember constantly being told you know insights is a support function in the organizations. You know insights was viewed as secondary players to the operators the merchants the frontline roles. Those were the real roles. you know, insights, you all don't own a P&L, you know, and it it and then we kind of reinforce that within our teams is that, you know, we just support the business, we support the business, but again, I think in reinforcing this idea that we were secondary to the rest of the organization. I think that we went from um being perceived as essential to being a nice to have. And oh yeah, I'll check with the insights team and see if they have anything that maybe we can, you know, use to help um uh round out our assessment of our strategies or our view of the customer. I think this secondary support function uh mentality also uh drove a perception that we weren't necessarily um indispensable but rather a cost center for the company and rather than seeing ourselves as a integral part of the business again we were seen as kind of this support function. I think that others within organization may have treated us this way and then I think we then took on that role at times in the past which is why I think when I hear someone saying how do I you know get that seat at the table or remain with that seat at the table that that's where that notion is coming from. So when we look at kind of the the things that I just outlined for you when we say you know where did our market parents miss where do we go wrong I kind of call you know kind of these steps as being the insights department death spiral right so one we're being me snobs about the methods we're using we're being too rigorous in way we're approaching problems we're holding back data from our partners ers being very c cautious and careful and then perceiving ourselves and having others perceive us as a support function which I think again through this erodess trust with our partners with our business with our clients and so when I take a step back and look at these things I say to myself you know there was a desire and the right thing to do but in hindsight you know why have these things why do these things need to evolve and why do we need to break them? And I think just to leave you with on this piece of it is um I think we need to break them because one we were devaluing certain methods for others in our snobbery. I think in terms of our rigor we were prioritizing precision over practicality. We were emphasizing the outputs that we were delivering more so than the outcomes. We were treating data as a weapon. This was fostering an us versus them mentality, which I think relegated insights to being seen as a nice to have um versus a need to have. So that's the old habits. Julie, are we good? Should I keep going? Yes, please. This is excellent so far. Love it. Thanks. Great. All right. So, we've talked about the past. Now let's talk about today and tomorrow. The habits that evolved and the necess necessity for this change. So in the past we were method snobs at times. I think in today's world we have to be methodic what what I call method agnostic. moving away from prioritizing certain methods to focusing on the best method to achieve what's needed for our clients and our partners. Actionable insights. This may mean um embracing new technologies and new tools such as AI um exploring neuroscience and be behavioral science. In my recent career, I've really leaned into neuroscience and behavioral science um tools and techniques to really enable and provide a more rounded and differentiated way of getting to insights um relative to the other people in my organization. Kind of being a leader in this area, the analytics team, you know, the others in the analytics groups. um really showcasing uh a breath not just a depth of understanding around the right methods for the right problem to solve for the right partners. The other thing I think we need to do is revisit this notion around qualitative as a differentiator uh especially as the proliferation of data and analytics teams I mean most companies are getting a lot of behavioral data they're getting a lot of quantitative uh information uh but what they don't realize is the strength lies in delivering the why behind the what that's the differentiator and that's where qualitative wins, right? So now you're bringing in the qualitative methods which provide a richer understanding of not just what the customer doing but what are the motivations and barriers to getting to that what the uh the customer is doing. Um, I think this gives again us a competitive advantage and edge because we can understand and be the voice of the customer in ways that other parts of the business cannot. And so I think being open and embracing um all of these different tools and methods will just make your toolkit stronger, better, more diverse and again puts you at a significant advantage um over your um peers and competitors. The second uh I think habit that need to evolve is going from kind of this focused on rigor to being more agile and actionable. I think in the past as I mentioned we often focused on the output. What will the report look like? What data tables do we need? Uh what does the discussion guide need to be? What did the survey? There was a lot of focus on the outputs, the tangible pieces of it. I think in this new world that we work in, we need to start with the end in mind. Start with what is the outcome for our partner or our client. Determine the client's needs, timeline and critical actions and then back into the outputs. Right? So then you design. So understanding the timing that's needed, what format it's needing it needed in and you know what are the critical pieces that are needed within that then you back into which methodology how much time you're going to spend on what and then in what form or fashion or format will you deliver that output. It's about practicality over precision. Um, you know, it's important that we uh provide accurate information for our partners uh and provide great information, great outputs. You know, we want to make it engaging. But I think we also uh need to recognize that uh a good answer on time is better than a perfect answer that's too late to, you know, to do anything. One of the other things I'm really passionate about is with the term agile kind of in the product management world and in the tech world, they've really adopted this agile mindset. And it's interesting because I think in the insights world, we have yet to really lean into um kind of this continuous improvement agile approach to working. Um I call it the iPhone approach. This is what I do with my teams is to say, you know, we're going to deliver like an iPhone does. We're going to deliver a solid version right now of the information that's timely. It's important. It's useful for what you need right now, but we also want to reserve the right to update with new information as it becomes available. So, I'm going to give you a good answer right now, client partner, but if we get more information in, more data, I also want to have the opportunity to come maybe come back to you and update with new information. So I think having this kind of continuous process and improvement way of working which I call again which is the agile way I think it will help us to stop being so u driven to perfection the first time around um and lead us to and lead us to those habits where we were before where we're getting paralyzed in terms of trying to make things right perfect the first time that we're not giving ourselves the wiggle room to be imperfect and to be continuous in the way we approach as many of other other teams have adopted this way of working along with that instead of being data gatekeepers we should be data collaborative it's not an all or nothing way of working I think that in the past we often saw data as a competitive advantage um something that insights teams owned over other functions and that's that was the wrong attitude. We should see data as a competitive advantage over our competitors not our partners. Um in this day and age I think it's important that we are transparent from the beginning to the end because I think that transparency with the data and the information will allow for those moments when you don't have everything perfect. you don't have everything all buttoned up, you can open up your data. You can share with your partner and foster and strengthen that partnership by saying, "Hey, look, we don't have all the answers today, but let me show you what we do have." Um, and then foster a shared sense of purpose. Again, the data is supposed to be democratized, right? Let them see it. A lot of times a partner is asking for raw data, but that's not really what they really meant. They really want, you know, an accessible tab or a pivot table. They just want to play in the data. they just don't always want the final report. And so I think it's kind of listening to what they're saying and say, "Okay, let's kind of peek behind, let you peek behind the curtain and see what's really going on." You know, I think that transparency leads to collaboration which then fosters that partnership that we so, you know, so desire. And with that, this is how we then build that relationship to be more integrated because they see us as being a partner with them in all aspects of the work. And we want to be we don't just want to show up with the data, drop it off and go back to our next project. We really want to be fully integrated. And along with being integrated, we want to be indispensable, right? We want to move from being seen as the insights partner to a business partner. integrating the insights with the business objectives showing that we are indispensable to making those strategic decisions. We want to create a scenar scenario where our business leaders want won't make a decision without consulting with us. That's what we want to get to, right? We want the align. We want to align our insights with the business needs and goals and we become essential to not just being a nice to have but to actually helping the company drive revenue as we are the voice of the customer and understand it better than anyone else in the organization. So when we flip the model from a spiral into what I call the insights department relevance evolution, this looks like, you know, we're coming to the table. We're being method agnostic. We're open. We're embracing ideas. We're being agile and flexing on what we're providing and how we're going to provide it. we're being collaborative which then enables this trust that leads to us being fully integrated and indispensable. So when I think back to why this change needs to happen, this necessity for change is one, this is how when I'm listening to these market research professionals at that conference, this is how you stay relevant. This is how you operate at the speed of the business and the partners aren't complaining about when am I going to get this, this, this, and this. These elements alo also differentiate you from the analytics department because you're bringing in this whole swath of tools and ways of working that allow you to really get to the heart and not just the mind of the customer. When you're collaborating, the data doesn't become a weapon but becomes a unifier with the rest of the organization. uh it positions market research that team the work you do as a competitive advantage for the business and then it integrated that the partners want integrated into their decision making and so therefore instead of being perceived as a cost center the work you do starts to be perceived as a revenue driver for the company and so with that being said That leaves with some call to actions or what I call key takeaways. Um to kind of reiterate the kind of the slides we just went through. So number one, position yourself and think of yourself as a business partner. I know that for myself, I will sit in uh creative briefing meet if you know when I'm working with the marketing department, I'm sitting in the creative briefings. I'm uh involved in the strategic uh business meetings. I want them to see me not just as oh let me call on Solomon when I have an insights question, but I want to be perceived as a thought partner and want us to be seen as not just an insights partner but a thought partner in what the business needs to be successful. Number two, as I mentioned, lead with the outcome, the why, and let that determine the output, the when, the what, and the how. A lot of times we get hung up in the outputs immediately. Okay, we got to do this, we got to do that, we got to do this. We got to spend more time in why are we doing this? What's the goal? focusing on the outcome more so than the output. That may lead us to start to embrace new methods and new tools to get to answers. Right? I talked about leveraging AI as a tool to make your work more efficient. um leveraging neural and behavioral science to unpack new ways and ideas for our partners to think about their business and their uh their customer. We should also leverage qualitative as a differentiator, not as the stepchild of the quantitative. Number five, as I talked about the iPhone approach, reserve the right to be agile. Again, as other departments have moved to kind of sprints and a and and the agile approach to doing work, insights teams need to adopt the same. And then the last thing is just expanding your relevance. Um, as I've moved in my career, I recognized that market research is really the foundation for a lot of the new disciplines that have come about, right? So, CX, EX, and UX. And while there are some nuances to all of those, if you have a foundation in market research like we have and like I have, I found that it makes the work in those disciplines even greater because you're bringing that foundation that some people um may have not had. uh because some of these disciplines have been developed and don't necessarily have had the years of um experience and backgrounds um as market research and when you think about it uh CX UX these are really evolutions of you know market research of the past when I think about path to purchase or decision trees really journey mapping is just an evolved version of a path to purchase or a decision And so when you kind of take a step back, as I was telling the folks at the market research conference, when you take a step back, you realize, yeah, the names changed, you know, the nomenclature changed, but foundationally and fundamentally, it's still the same approach, right? People are people, and you're trying to understand what makes them tick. And that uh that evolution um you know has evolved and looks very different but it's fundamentally the same. We just want to understand our customers as best as we can. And so those are my key takeaways. I thank you um for uh the time here. Um I've left my contact information. Feel free to reach out um for conversations. uh always open to new opportunities. Um and thank you for this time and Julie, I'll hand it to you. Alrighty. Well, thank you very much. That was really excellent and inspiring for those of us who've also been in research for 20 plus years. I think you were spot on on a lot of your observations. Um I don't see a ton of questions, but um people did comment that they loved your analogy for the iPhone. I think that's really great. Um, I actually have a question for you though, but um, so one of the things you're doing in your internal department is supporting your internal clients. Tell me some strategies that you use to help them upsell to their bosses that they should do this research because a lot of times I find when you're talking to other research professionals, you know, they they get it. they understand why they need to do it, but they don't know how to articulate how to sell it upstairs so they can get the money. So, what kind of strategies do you use to do that? Yeah, I think the it's what I talked about, which is understanding the real outcomes. Um, I've heard things like, we're trying to determine the price of this and we're trying to determine the price of that. And then when I understand that, okay, you're trying to understand pricing, then I can roll out the cool tech tools and techniques and get them bought into the methodology and the approach. And that may mean I'm hiring a vendor to do it. But that's when I can pull out like, "Oh, we should do a Van West." And then they go, "Oh, what's that?" Right? But if I come in and I lead with, "Oh, in order to do this, you need to do A, B, and C." I find that it falls on deaf ears. But when I start with listening to what they're looking for, then it helps me to say, "Okay, well, that's going to cost you a little more. Oh, that's going to require a little bit more time." So, it's again, it's what I talked about, which is starting with the outcome and then backing into that out. So, I don't go in um trying to sell them on approach or methodology or sell them on something. I really listen to what their needs are first and then determine from there okay what are we gonna do and how much money do we need to spend or how little or what do we need to get involved? So, it's it's really about um starting with their their need first, right? Okay, great. Um I don't have a question, but I do have a comment. Um it's true the names and lingo changes, but the approach and result that's needed is the same. Thank you for your presentation. Um yeah. So um I guess the only other question I would have for you is I I really u the res it resonated when you talked about the analytics versus the insight and I found I I've actually run a CX program myself and I've always tried to explain to people that you know CX is really looking in the rearview mirror like what happened before. Tell me about some techniques that you use to take um analytics like a CX metric like an NPS score and talk about what's going to happen in the future like what does it mean? Why are people acting like they do? How do you address that when you're talking about like looking at an NPS score? What do you do with it? Yes. Yes. So that's the thing. So um at Resource for example um the GX what we call guest experience is combined with our strategic research team. So those two teams rolled up under me and it's just that we look at we we leverage the CX side to tell us what's happening um you know and we and we leverage the comments and the sentiment and all of that to kind of help us predict what it is but then we then have to launch a you know a quant survey or do some qualitative to really get to what does this mean for the future and so it's it's you got to have both sides. You got to have the you got to have the hindsight and the insight to get to the foresight. And so I don't see them as competing. I see them as complimentary. And again, this is how you sell partners and clients on it's like, okay, you know what's happening today, right? But you need to know what's going to happen tomorrow. And that's where you got to have that primary research in order to do that. So it's really yeah, it's it's help taking them on the journey um to get to that. But it's it's both pieces are relevant and you got to have you really need to have both of them. So, okay. And we have another uh question. How do you convince stakeholders to go beyond one deliverable report? Oftentimes clients lean to report by a certain date and expect all insights to be there. So, um it's interesting because I have found that when you really talk to partners, um you find that it's it's almost like you have to you have to negotiate with the partners in a sense of saying, "Okay, this is this is what um you need this by when and this is what we can deliver by when and it's going to have all of these things, but if you need something beyond that, it's going going to take more time. I think it's it's it's you have to retrain the partner because they're used to a a certain expectation from insights. And I don't blame the partner. I blame us now to say we've got to push back. And that's the reality. We have to say you want a good answer by this date. This is what we can give you. Realistically, it's going to be it's going to be as best as we can, but if you want something more, we're going to have to say it's going to take a little bit more time. And again, it's a retrain because other disciplines are doing it now. Other disciplines are saying, "We're going moving at sprints. You're going to get this by this and you're going to get that by that." And so, it's really incumbent upon us to help our partners with that. And I find that they'll back down. They'll be like, "Okay, yeah, that." So I've I've found that we just need to stop being afraid to push back and not push back in a way that doesn't make sense but by saying not no but but or just yes and and yes and but to say hey we can't get now but what we can give you is this. So right u I would say it's just it's a retrain we have to do um as a as a function within within um companies. So all right um some more comments here. I 100% agree with the agile idea. We use the fail fast methodology to ensure we don't keep digging on a piece of research that isn't yielding results. Yes. And lots of accolades too. I'm getting that in the comments as well. Yes. Yes. So import so important to again um that agile mindset like like the comment is as researchers. Okay. This is what we're seeing. How does this align with what you're looking for? Is this what we're getting at? Again, we've got to build into our work sprints. We've got to build into our work pause moments with our partners sooner than later. Um, but again, I think I think it's it's up to us to do that, not our partners. We we have to train them on how to work with us differently. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Great. All right. Well, that pretty much wraps up the questions. I did want to mention I looked on your LinkedIn before we had this session and you have a a little report series that you've got going on there. I have. Yes. Why don't you talk about that a little bit and just so people can see you at at LinkedIn and look those up on your posts right? Yeah. So, I've recently again this I told you I went to this and the presentation's over now. I went to this conference last year and I was so frustrated. I was hearing things from people that I just mentioned earlier um that were frustrating me because um they've been in the business a long time and they're they're at a crossroad an inflection point and they don't know what to do. And so that inspired me to start writing these articles and so if you go to my LinkedIn I've written three articles and I'll just keep writing them that kind of hit on some of the topics that I cover today. Um but it's really about helping my peers um to just really evolve and to um you know make it in this in this ever changing world where it feels like um primary research and market research um has been become the Kelly Roland to analytics and so you know how do we you know how do we become if we're not Beyonce at least Rihanna how do we compete with them and be equally you know on the foot um equally uh perceived um as analytics um continues to you know proliferate with with all the uh data that's again that's coming out. So but again you still need that qual you still need that um primary research to go with it. So I I encourage everyone to check out the articles if you have it on my LinkedIn um and I'll continue to uh write them as I'm inspired um by the things I'm hearing. All right. Excellent. Well, thank you so much for spending time with us today. It was excellent. And I'm going to recommend other people also again uh if you weren't able to um to see the whole thing or or what have you um all of these presentations today are going to be archived on our conference site. Um and they're also available on YouTube. They'll be there for a few days. So, please download them, share them. Um go visit Solomon's LinkedIn uh and our other speakers as well. And I want to thank everyone for participating and hope to see you next month. Thanks again. Thank you. Bye everyone.